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Post by valpomike on Feb 24, 2010 6:00:33 GMT 1
Only if you have a permit, and they are hard to come by, but you can have it in your home, so when a problem comes into the home, you can blow them away, and be safe, and you don't have to use a table leg, or a toy gun, like the poor guy in Poland had.
Here in Indiana, it is not as hard to get a permit to carry, I had one for several years. You must undergo a strict background check by the state, city, and federal.
Mike
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uncltim
Just born
I oppose most nonsense.
Posts: 73
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Post by uncltim on Feb 26, 2010 5:00:42 GMT 1
Bo,
I also hold a permit to carry a concealed weapon. My wife and niece also. It never ceases to amaze me that this is a common topic amongst Europeans. I would bet that any European who has come to the states has never seen a gun here except for maybe in the holster of a police officer. Thats pretty remarkable considering that there are a couple hundred million guns in the US. The fact of the matter is that we are really quite responsible when it comes to gun ownership. People who act recklessly with a firearm in the states have a very short life expectancy. They are as likely to be killed by their fellow citizen as they are by the police. This is never reported in the state run media but firearms are used everyday by citizens to protect their lives and property. Generally they don't even need to be fired, just making their presence known to a potential criminal is more than enough to de-escalate a situation.
Keep in mind that you also have the right to choose not to have one. Simple enough. I find the argument that banning guns would make the country safer to be quite silly. Safer for whom? To me, It would be like saying that removing door locks would prevent burglaries! Thats just crazy.
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Post by valpomike on Feb 26, 2010 17:19:01 GMT 1
We here in the USA want the right to bear arms. We may some day need to protect our selfs, when others come here, and want to take over, like Europe during WW II, and other times. If the people have guns, they may have been able to stop, or slow down a take over. I want my rights of gun ownership, and will not ever give up my guns.
Mike
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Post by Bonobo on Mar 1, 2010 14:43:07 GMT 1
Bo, I also hold a permit to carry a concealed weapon. My wife and niece also. I see. You are used to keeping them with you. I Probably. I never saw guns in New York. Only heard shots (rarely) and watched the news reporting killings and massacres by firearm. Tha`ts terrifying. Such a beautiful country infested with deadly machines. One of the reason I wouldn`t like to live in US. American gun culture is so odd to me. T I don`t think so. Massacres at schools and universities prove sth else. And such songs too: Hey man you know I'm really okay
The gun in my hand will tell you the same
But when I'm in my car
Don't give me no crap
Cause the slightest thing and I just might snap
When I go driving I stay in my lane
But getting cut off it makes me insane
I open the glove box
Reach inside
I'm gonna wreck this f**ker's ride
I guess I got a bad habit
Of blowin' away
Yeah I got a bad habit
And it ain't goin' away Yeah
Well they say the road is a dangerous place
If you flip me off I'm the danger you'll face
If you drive on my ass
Your foot's on the gas
And your next breath is your last
Drivers are rude
Such attitudes
But when i show my peace
Complaints cease
Something's odd
I Feel like I'm god
You stupid dumbshit goddam motherf**ker
I open the glove box
Reach inside
I'm gonna wreck this f**ker's ride But before they are done with terminally, they take a few other people with them. G Allowing guns in Poland would escalate the situation ,that`s for sure. First, criminals would get guns, then citizens would have to get more and better etc etc. K Yes, but I feel safer knowing that my crazy neighbour hasn`t got a gun either. If he attacks, I will be able to repel the attack with sth else than a gun. I No. It is too late for US to ban guns. Decent people would listen criminals wouldn`t. But the intrpduction of gun permits in Poland would make America of this country and I don`t want it. [/quote] |
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Post by valpomike on Mar 1, 2010 17:34:50 GMT 1
We here in the USA have always had guns, and want to keep them. Even with laws, guns, all over the world, fall into the wrong hands, so we need guns to protect our selfs, against those who have them and should not have them.
I would be hard to change the Polish ways, but if Poland had guns during the wars, it could have helped.
Mike
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Post by justjohn on Apr 12, 2010 19:13:30 GMT 1
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Post by justjohn on Apr 12, 2010 19:14:37 GMT 1
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Post by tufta on Apr 12, 2010 19:53:14 GMT 1
The picture is really funny. But the message will work only in a society where a criminal knows almost EVERYONE has a gun, Like in US. There he is armed too, and will use this gun. In society where almost nobody has a gun a criminal often goes unarmed. With less guns simply less people are dead. Even a thief's, a burglar's life is more precious than a new tv set.  As to Swiss. They have military guns at home as they have a ver peculiar form of the army. They cannot use this guns the way Americans can. Finally, all that is not to say I am against or for the guns in US. It is not my businnes.  |
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Post by Bonobo on Apr 12, 2010 20:44:19 GMT 1
The picture is really funny. But the message will work only in a society where a criminal knows almost EVERYONE has a gun, Like in US. There he is armed too, and will use this gun. In society where almost nobody has a gun a criminal often goes unarmed. With less guns simply less people are dead. Even a thief's, a burglar's life is more precious than a new tv set. The hope that having a gun at home will protect you from robbers/burglars is allusive, I suppose. A villain will not relinquish his plans to rob you, he can only get more brutal because of stress and fear. Let alone he will be armed too, and completely ready to use his weapon, while you are a normal citizen with a lot of doubts. Besides, a bandit attack doesn`t take hours so that you can prepare yourself, it is rather seconds during which you have no time to reach for the gun. It is not about whether to ban guns in US or not. It is too late for America now and they have to carry on, despite all those mass shootings - recently there was another one. It is whether to allow guns in Poland. And I must say - no. I wouldn`t feel safer having a gun at home. Quite the opposite - I would be only more afraid. Intentional murder statistics: USA - not so bad after all. 5.4 murders per 100.000. Poland - 1.28. Highest - Honduras with 58. Lowest - Singapore - 0.38 |
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Post by valpomike on Apr 14, 2010 14:37:04 GMT 1
When bad people think you don't have a gun, due to the law, they will think they are free to enter your home whenever, but if they think you could have a gun, they may think twice.
Guns don't kill people, people kill people. If some one wanted to hurt me, or my family, I want to have my gun to protect them.
Mike
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Post by Bonobo on Jun 26, 2010 18:44:23 GMT 1
During a heated argument, while drinking alcohol, a hunter shot his mate, and then himself.  A 25 yo son had an argument with his mother and used a revolver which belonged to his father, a retired army officer. Both son and mother were taken to hospital.  She shot her enstranged lover and buried him under the concrete floor in the garage. A few years later she dug out the remains and burnt them. She did it for her lover`s property. She was sentenced though the ashes were never found.  |
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Post by valpomike on Jun 26, 2010 19:38:46 GMT 1
Here we go again. When you take away guns from all, the bad ones, will still find a way to get guns. In Chicago, all guns are outlawed, and yet, they have several killings by guns each day, and a person who wants to defend themself, can't have guns.
I think there can be a good gun control, but not by taking them all away, from all.
Mike
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Post by Bonobo on Jun 29, 2010 20:47:49 GMT 1
Here we go again. When you take away guns from all, the bad ones, will still find a way to get guns. In Chicago, all guns are outlawed, and yet, they have several killings by guns each day, and a person who wants to defend themself, can't have guns. I think there can be a good gun control, but not by taking them all away, from all. Mike It is too late to save America. There is still a chance to save Poland. In a simple way - keep the restrictions on guns. |
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Post by valpomike on Jul 3, 2010 15:34:52 GMT 1
What do you mean, to late to save America. This is a great place to live, and have children and grandchildren. And with our guns, we can help keep them safe. Someone may not think of breaking into my home, thinking I may have a gun.
Mike
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Post by justjohn on Jul 12, 2010 20:09:29 GMT 1
 The Gun IS civilization, plain and simple-- A very astute letter from a retired Marine.. (Semper Fi) Date: Sunday, 11-Jul-2010 18:06:08 Interesting take and one you don't hear much. . . . . . As the Supreme Court hears arguments for and against the Chicago, IL Gun Ban, I offer you another stellar example of a letter (written by a Marine) that places the proper perspective on what a gun means to a civilized society. Read this eloquent and profound letter and pay close attention to the last paragraph of the letter... The Gun is Civilization by Maj. L. Caudill USMC (Ret) Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force. If you want me to do something for you, you have a choice of either convincing me via argument, or force me to do your bidding under threat of force. Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories, without exception. Reason or force, that's it. In a truly moral and civilized society, people exclusively interact through persuasion. Force has no place as a valid method of social interaction, and the only thing that removes force from the menu is the personal firearm, as paradoxical as it may sound to some. When I carry a gun, you cannot deal with me by force. You have to use reason and try to persuade me, because I have a way to negate your threat or employment of force. The gun is the only personal weapon that puts a 100-pound woman on equal footing with a 220-pound mugger, a 75-year old retiree on equal footing with a 19-year old gang banger, and a single guy on equal footing with a carload of drunk guys with baseball bats. The gun removes the disparity in physical strength, size, or numbers between a potential attacker and a defender. There are plenty of people who consider the gun as the source of bad force equations. These are the people who think that we'd be more civilized if all guns were removed from society, because a firearm makes it easier for a [armed] mugger to do his job. That, of course, is only true if the mugger's potential victims are mostly disarmed either by choice or by legislative fiat--it has no validity when most of a mugger's potential marks are armed. People who argue for the banning of arms ask for automatic rule by the young, the strong, and the many, and that's the exact opposite of a civilized society. A mugger, even an armed one, can only make a successful living in a society where the state has granted him a force monopoly. Then there's the argument that the gun makes confrontations lethal that otherwise would only result in injury. This argument is fallacious in several ways. Without guns involved, confrontations are won by the physically superior party inflicting overwhelming injury on the loser. People who think that fists, bats, sticks, or stones don't constitute lethal force watch too much TV, where people take beatings and come out of it with a bloody lip at worst. The fact that the gun makes lethal force easier works solely in favor of the weaker defender, not the stronger attacker. If both are armed, the field is level. The gun is the only weapon that's as lethal in the hands of an octogenarian as it is in the hands of a weight lifter. It simply wouldn't work as well as a force equalizer if it wasn't both lethal and easily employable. When I carry a gun, I don't do so because I am looking for a fight, but because I'm looking to be left alone. The gun at my side means that I cannot be forced, only persuaded. I don't carry it because I'm afraid, but because it enables me to be unafraid. It doesn't limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason, only the actions of those who would do so by force. It removes force from the equation... and that's why carrying a gun is a civilized act. By Maj. L. Caudill USMC (Ret) So the greatest civilization is one where all citizens are equally armed and can only be persuaded, never forced.
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Post by jeanne on Jul 12, 2010 22:31:16 GMT 1
In a truly moral and civilized society, people exclusively interact through persuasion. Force has no place as a valid method of social interaction, and the only thing that removes force from the menu is the personal firearm, as paradoxical as it may sound to some. Given human nature, no society is EVER truly moral and civilized. Therefore, you will always have the crazies who will abuse firearms. If everyone has a gun, of course someone can deal with you by force. They just have to pull the trigger FIRST!. Sorry, but I hate guns...and I don't think that putting them in everyone's hands is the way to a moral and civilized society. |
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Post by valpomike on Jul 13, 2010 1:21:34 GMT 1
It is bad that we may need guns to keep our self and family safe, but there is another reason. If every they come over here in war, we want to be able to fight back.
Mike
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Post by tufta on Jul 15, 2010 18:20:33 GMT 1
Sorry, but I hate guns...and I don't think that putting them in everyone's hands is the way to a moral and civilized society. Of course Jeanne, you don't. Because being a 100% true American lady, you are the most European-like at the same time ;D ;D ;D ;D |
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Post by jeanne on Jul 15, 2010 20:53:21 GMT 1
Sorry, but I hate guns...and I don't think that putting them in everyone's hands is the way to a moral and civilized society. Of course Jeanne, you don't. Because being a 100% true American lady, you are the most European-like at the same time ;D ;D ;D ;D Tufta, I hope that's a compliment, because I'm taking it as one! ;D ;D ;D Does that mean I can move to Poland and that I'll fit in with the culture? |
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Post by valpomike on Jul 15, 2010 22:42:08 GMT 1
What will you do when someone tries to break in your home, and hurt you and your family? If you call the police, they could be to late.
Mike
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Post by tufta on Jul 15, 2010 22:53:10 GMT 1
Of course Jeanne, you don't. Because being a 100% true American lady, you are the most European-like at the same time ;D ;D ;D ;D Tufta, I hope that's a compliment, because I'm taking it as one! ;D ;D ;D Does that mean I can move to Poland and that I'll fit in with the culture? Exactly so! |
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Post by tufta on Jul 15, 2010 22:54:21 GMT 1
What will you do when someone tries to break in your home, and hurt you and your family? If you call the police, they could be to late. Mike Mike, did such situation ever happen to you? |
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Post by Bonobo on Jul 25, 2010 21:26:30 GMT 1
What will you do when someone tries to break in your home, and hurt you and your family? If you call the police, they could be to late. Mike I have a container with pepper gas but I don`t know where it is, really. Somewhere under my papers. In Poland an average citizen isn`t troubled by guys trying to break into while you are in. But.... During our vacation I bought an old communist police baton and a pair of real hadcuffs at a military picnic. The baton is for me as a nice souvenir, handcuffs are for my sons to play. But I think I can use them to deal with unwelcome guests. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D  |
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Post by Bonobo on Jul 25, 2010 21:47:39 GMT 1
It should read: American civilization. ;D ;D ;D ;D John, do you know the statistics? What is ratio of people who successfully managed to defend themselves or their property with firearms and those who didn`t though they had a gun on them or at home? A few quotes from the letter: and the only thing that removes force from the menu is the personal firearm, as paradoxical as it may sound to some.Hmm, I am afraid it is an illusion. The gun doesn`t prevent force, it only enhances it. According to that opinion, there should be no crime in US, with 100 million pieces of firearms spread all over the country. To my knowledge, crime rates are high in US. Why hasn`t the gun access stopped crime in US yet? When I carry a gun, you cannot deal with me by force. I can. It is enough that I take you by surprise or during the confrontation I am faster and knock you out before you manage to take out a gun. (of course not me, but a professional )
The gun is the only personal weapon that puts a 100-pound woman on equal footing with a 220-pound mugger, a 75-year old retiree on equal footing with a 19-year old gang banger, and a single guy on equal footing with a carload of drunk guys with baseball bats.
Do these potential victims always keep their hands on guns to be ready?
When I carry a gun, I don't do so because I am looking for a fight, but because I'm looking to be left alone. The gun at my side means that I cannot be forced, only persuaded. I don't carry it because I'm afraid, but because it enables me to be unafraid. It doesn't limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason, only the actions of those who would do so by force. It removes force from the equation... and that's why carrying a gun is a civilized act.It is still enough to carry tear gas in your pocket in Poland. |
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Post by Bonobo on Aug 30, 2010 13:23:39 GMT 1
A drunk psycho started shooting several illegal pieces of firearms at his family after they didn`t agree to his inviting friends for barbecue. 7 people are seriosly wounded. Was overpowered by swat unit. See the film: www.tvn24.pl/12690,1671365,0,1,strzelal-mercedesem-wsrod-pistoletow-maszynowych,wiadomosc.html   |
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Post by Bonobo on Oct 21, 2010 17:58:44 GMT 1
The assassin revealed he has been contacting organized crime groups to buy a machine gun, Kalashnikov. He was turned down.
Imagine what massacre he would caryy out if he was allowed to legally obtain a gun in Poland.
Wanted to kill “any politician, from any party”
It has transpired that Ryszard C. was planning the murder for a year, and was not necessarily aiming for Law and Justice leader Jaroslaw Kaczynski, rather wanting to kill “any politician, from any party, so that they would not be so self-confident.”
According to Gazeta Wyborcza, Ryszard C. had earlier tried to kill former Prime Minister Leszek Miller “but it didn’t work out,” the taxi driver told his jailers.
Jaroslaw Kaczynski targeted?
The taxi driver was travelling around Poland since July in order to plot his attack on the Law and Justice office.
“We are going to check where he was, if assistants at other Law and Justice offices remember him, as well as check other party offices in other towns, and whether [Ryszard C.] came near Nowogrodzka street in Warsaw [where the national HQ of Law and Justice is located,” a high-ranking bureaucrat at the Prime Minister’s Chancellery told the daily.
Police and special services are trying to ascertain whether Ryszard C. had tried to plan an attack on the opposition leader, a move which was prompted by the murderer’s words upon arrest: “I wanted to kill Kaczynski, but my gun was too small.”
Earlier stakeout…hit list?
According to the daily Polska The Times, Ryszard C. visited the Law and Justice offices in Lodz a day before he committed the crime. He spoke with Law and Justice MEP Janusz Wojciechowski’s assistant, who he murdered the next day, and obtained a list of party candidates standing for the Lodz local council elections.
The list was found on Ryszard C. when taken into custody, along with a box containing 49 rounds of ammunition for a Walther pistol.
Investigators have also discerned that Ryszard C. had been in Lodz since the 13 October, first staying in a room at the city’s Savoy hotel, and then moving to the Centrum hotel, from where he left at 10.00 CET on Tuesday for the Law and Justice office.
Police have secured a Renault hire car, as well as Ryszard C.’s personal belongings from the hotel room, including a laptop, clothes and a Canadian passport.
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Post by tufta on Oct 21, 2010 18:06:56 GMT 1
The assassin revealed he has been contacting organized crime groups to buy a machine gun, Kalashnikov. He was turned down. Imagine what massacre he would caryy out if he was allowed to legally obtain a gun in Poland.
Again - exactly!!! At the same time Mr. Chairman's idea it was all 'against PiS' falls. The guy was sick, just sick and who he killed was secondary to him. |
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Post by Bonobo on Mar 20, 2011 14:51:44 GMT 1
New firearms law passed in Poland
10.03.2011 16:33
An amended law on firearms and explosives has come into force in Poland.
The most important change introduced are more stringent requirements for obtaining a licence to carry firearms.
Persons convicted for criminal offenses or tax related crimes will not be eligible for such permits, as will those with records of involuntary manslaughter, battery, crimes committed under the influence of alcohol or perpetrators of road collisions who fled the scene of the accident.
Another novelty is a more precise definition of the so-called register of positive prerequisites, whereby law enforcement bodies cannot decide arbitrarily on factors for granting firearm permits. Now, the police is obliged to grant a licence if the applicant satisfies all mandatory requirements.
The main requirements for obtaining permission to carry and use firearms have been maintained, for example, passing relevant medical and psychological examinations as well as tests on legal aspects governing the use such weapons.
Additionally, when filing for a permit the candidates must state the purpose of their application and the exact type and number of weapons they intend to use.
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Post by Bonobo on Apr 10, 2011 1:01:45 GMT 1
Another massacre, this time in Holland.
A gunman entered a shopping mall in the Netherlands and at least killed six people and wounded a dozen more before taking his own life.
The mass murder occurred at the crowded Ridderhof shopping center in Alphen aan den Rijn, a town of about 70,000 people, located 15 miles southwest of Amsterdam.
According to reports, the killer fired an automatic weapon at shoppers and turned the gun on himself. He has not been officially identified yet and no motive is known.
However, a Dutch newspaper De Telegraaf reported that he was a 24-year-old resident of Alphen aan den Rijn who lived with his parents in an apartment near the mall.
Witnesses described the man to Dutch media as being about 25 years old with long blonde hair. He wore a leather jacket and camouflage pattern trousers.
A shopkeeper in the Ridderhof centre told Dutch broadcaster NOS: "There was a panic in the mall, a lot of people running. I see the attacker coming, walking, and I go inside the store... and I see him going by with a big machine gun."
Police stated the gunman appeared to fire at random and that he acted alone.
Mayor Bas Eenhoorn described the tragedy as "unprecedented.”
"It's hardly credible that our town could experience such slaughter, and on a day as beautiful as this," he said.
However, this is not the first such mass shooting in the area. On April 2, two people were killed in a shooting in the same district of the town.
A witness told BBC: "It's weird that something like this has happened in this neighborhood. Usually nothing ever happens here. But this is the second shooting in two weeks.”
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Post by valpomike on Apr 10, 2011 1:59:19 GMT 1
They will never get my guns, they will have to pry them from my cold dead hands. If some one wants to kill, and they don't have a gun, they will find a way.
Mike
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