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Post by Bonobo on Jan 3, 2009 16:40:15 GMT 1
Most Poles use either gas heaters or or coal stovesfor heating water, sometimes for heating the apartment too, . Unfortunately, both systems cause many victims of CO, carbon monoxide. Currently, there is such news practically every day. Only in Krakow region 6 people have died this winter so far. Two young women in Krakow died of CO inhalation from a broken gas heater in the bathroom. www.tvn24.pl/12690,1579813,0,1,czad-zabil-dwie-mlode-kobiety,wiadomosc.html  Temperatures are low. Homeless or lonely people who don`t get proper help die of freezing. A 78 yo woman in Zakopane died alone in her freezing cold flat. www.tvn24.pl/12690,1579867,0,1,pierwsze-ofiary-mrozu,wiadomosc.html  Winter is too mild in some regions. Waters don`t freeze properly. A 56 year old angler drowned after ice crushed under his feet.  www.tvn24.pl/12690,1579878,0,1,wedkarz-zginal-pod-lodem,wiadomosc.html |
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Post by franciszek on Jan 6, 2009 23:32:59 GMT 1
It always upsets me when i hear casualties of CO deaths and injury as there is no need for it to happen i always alert people to invest in a CO detector which now can be bought in the UK for as little as £20 I do appreciate the less well off would buy heat before a detector.I also believe governments should help out only recently the fire brigade fitted me 2 smoke detectors free of charge a service they provide I don't need a CO detector because i know what to look out for but the many that don't will always suffer such tragedy.In the UK have 50 deaths a year who is responsible for gas safety in Poland and what are the penalties for incompetent work in the UK i could face a manslaughter charge with up to 5-10 years in jail.
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Post by Bonobo on Jan 8, 2009 0:35:33 GMT 1
It always upsets me when i hear casualties of CO deaths and injury as there is no need for it to happen i always alert people to invest in a CO detector which now can be bought in the UK for as little as £20 Wow, I didn`t know such a thing was invented. My condo/flat is regularly checked (twice a year) by engineers/experts hired by the housing cooperative which looks after their buildings. If they find out a problem, they notify the gas company which cuts off the supply till you remove the problem, mostly repair the gas heater in the bathroom. However, private houses are not checked, people can do what they want there. The services intervene only when there is a gas leak or CO poisoning. Hmm, I think in Poland it is called causing negligent hazard. I don`t know about punishments. |
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Post by franciszek on Jan 8, 2009 1:38:51 GMT 1
so called experts dont no every thing my advise as a expert is buy a co detector if you cannot buy one in Poland give me an address and i will send you one free of charge on the condition you tell people about it !
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Post by franciszek on Jan 8, 2009 1:49:44 GMT 1
i will provide any expert advise for people who need it please dont anybody suffer i am the online plumber gas engineer who is online and free to this forum ask me for any advise on this subject i will answer if i can generally plumbing is universall !!!!
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gigi
Kindergarten kid
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Post by gigi on Jan 8, 2009 14:48:11 GMT 1
I agree with you Franciszek - CO detectors are very important to have. We have four in our home. Many states now require them in new construction, and because of Nicole's Law, existing residences may also require them:
Nicole’s Law:
* In 2005, Massachusetts passed Nicole's Law which requires that carbon monoxide detectors be installed in all residences that have any source of carbon monoxide such as fossil-fuel burning equipment (like natural gas, propane, oil, wood, coal and gasoline) or an enclosed or attached garage. "Nicole's Law" was named after 7-year old Nicole Garofalo, who died in 2005 from carbon monoxide poisoning when the furnace vents in her Plymouth home became blocked by snow and her house filled with deadly amounts of the gas.
* Carbon Monoxide (CO) is a colorless, odorless, poisonous gas that results from the incomplete combustion of fossil fuels like petroleum gas, oil, wood, coal or other fuels. Signs and symptoms of carbon monoxide poisoning can include headache, nausea, dizziness, and lethargy, which are often mistaken for flu symptoms. Elderly residents over the age of 65 have the highest carbon monoxide poisoning death rate, and are at higher rixk for undetected exposure.
* Since the enactment of Nicole’s Law in March 2006, between 2005-2006 there was a 93% increase of CO related calls to fire departments.
Main Components of the law:
* The law requires carbon monoxide alarms be installed on every level of the home, including habitable portions of basements and attics, in most residences.
* On levels with sleeping areas, carbon monoxide alarms should be installed within 10-feet of bedroom doors.
* Levels of the home that do not have habitable living spaces are not required to have CO alarms.
* Nicole’s Law also requires landlords to install and maintain CO alarms in every dwelling unit that has a source of carbon monoxide.
* Large apartment buildings, where there is no source inside the individual apartments, may use an alternative method to detect CO near the furnace or boiler rooms.
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Post by franciszek on Jan 8, 2009 21:00:14 GMT 1
Bravo!! I have always said that the UK needs a law like that it would save so many lives over here CORGI (the gas industries governing body) are always banging on about CO awareness and trying to teach the public,this is no good if you tell someone you recommend they have a CO detector most will listen but there are others who will say how much?and not bother.If on the other hand the law says you have to have one then they have no choice.This march CORGI is no more and a new company called CAPITA takes over the role i am going to forward Nicole's law to them and see what they have to say about this and i will show all the gas fitters i see in the plumbers merchants and any where else i see fit.Thank you very much for sharing that article it has made my day what a wonderful world this forum is.
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gigi
Kindergarten kid
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Post by gigi on Jan 8, 2009 22:11:14 GMT 1
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Post by tufta on Jan 9, 2009 15:31:38 GMT 1
Lovely name for a law  |
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Post by franciszek on Jan 9, 2009 20:58:46 GMT 1
Well done for finding this I live 2 hours from Newcastle and have not heard of this scheme and have not seen anything in the latest CORGI magazine Iwill check this months when it arrives. |
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Post by Bonobo on Jan 9, 2009 21:37:46 GMT 1
www.tvn24.pl/-1,1580765,0,1,zmarla-trzecia-z-zaczadzonych-siostr,wiadomosc.html The third sister died today. Two other and their grandmother died on 23 December. Grandfather survived.  i will provide any expert advise for people who need it please dont anybody suffer i am the online plumber gas engineer who is online and free to this forum ask me for any advise on this subject i will answer if i can generally plumbing is universall !!!! I got interested in the topic and started checking CO detectors. The prices range from 78 zlotys (close to your 20 pounds) to 200. Look at the site: www.czujniki.net/ Do you know these brands? Kidde and Euro?
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Post by franciszek on Jan 9, 2009 21:51:03 GMT 1
Not heard of these brands but i dont really know any names for co detectors i just presume they all work i have a industrial one which cost £120 but this is a working tool i will see what my local merchant stocks or you can check out PLUMB CENTER which is a part of the WOLSLEY GROUP this is a large group with outlets around the world all their products are good quality once they were very expensive but now they are becoming competative.
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gigi
Kindergarten kid
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Post by gigi on Jan 9, 2009 22:03:29 GMT 1
What a heartbreaking tragedy.
I am glad that you have been researching the CO detectors. Kidde is a very good brand. We have the Kidde Nighthawk detector.
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Post by franciszek on Jan 9, 2009 22:07:39 GMT 1
www.tvn24.pl/-1,1580765,0,1,zmarla-trzecia-z-zaczadzonych-siostr,wiadomosc.html The third sister died today. Two other and their grandmother died on 23 December. Grandfather survived. Very sad what age where they.Grandfather must be devastated he will probably go soon himself he has lost his world my heartfelt condolences for him thanks for starting this sad thread but things like this need to be high lighted. I told my boss about Nicole's law he agreed entirely my crusade has started i am piecing these clips together to send to the relevant authorities (web address and names not included)My daily job requires me not to harm anybody in the course of my work some gas fitters don't have this conscience i can sleep at night don't now how they do |
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Post by Bonobo on Jan 9, 2009 23:02:32 GMT 1
Very sad what age where they.Grandfather must be devastated he will probably go soon himself he has lost his world my heartfelt condolences for him thanks for starting this sad thread but things like this need to be high lighted. I told my boss about Nicole's law he agreed entirely my crusade has started i am piecing these clips together to send to the relevant authorities (web address and names not included)My daily job requires me not to harm anybody in the course of my work some gas fitters don't have this conscience i can sleep at night don't now how they do They were triplets, 4 years old. |
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Post by franciszek on Jan 10, 2009 13:48:27 GMT 1
The world has lost 3 beautiful girls so heatbreaking
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Post by Bonobo on Jan 10, 2009 19:03:47 GMT 1
What a heartbreaking tragedy. I am glad that you have been researching the CO detectors. Kidde is a very good brand. We have the Kidde Nighthawk detector. Good. I will get one. |
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Post by franciszek on Jan 11, 2009 10:26:49 GMT 1
Good i am glad you are getting one make sure you read instructions carefully as i think they have a life span of 5years thanks Gigi for recommending the detector i am glad i mentioned them makes my gas training all the more worth while gas fitters have a great deal of responsibility something our customers don't always appreciate,not that we moan about it we do what we do but if we can prevent injury to people then all the better if anyone was ever injured by my neglect and not doing things i am trained to do i would destroy my CORGI card and never work with gas again!
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Post by franciszek on Jan 11, 2009 13:48:32 GMT 1
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tomek
Nursery kid
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Post by tomek on Jan 11, 2009 23:18:11 GMT 1
Good i am glad you are getting one make sure you read instructions carefully as i think they have a life span of 5years thanks Gigi for recommending the detector i am glad i mentioned them makes my gas training all the more worth while gas fitters have a great deal of responsibility something our customers don't always appreciate,not that we moan about it we do what we do but if we can prevent injury to people then all the better if anyone was ever injured by my neglect and not doing things i am trained to do i would destroy my CORGI card and never work with gas again! on my villeege a old man was dead when he sleeping in a room full of gas. The heating burner was broke and the deadly gas came onto the room and killed man. This happen around 10 years back. My family has big oil burner in beisment. |
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Post by franciszek on Jan 12, 2009 21:03:43 GMT 1
Make sure yours is safe to CO from all forms of heating oil,gas coal and bottled gas room sealed are the safest depending on age and if they are well maintained
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Post by tufta on Jan 13, 2009 18:28:49 GMT 1
Franciszek, thanks! I have orderer Kidde Nighthawk, just in case - we have a gas central/water heater in the basement.
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Post by franciszek on Jan 13, 2009 22:13:43 GMT 1
Good prevention is better than cure, sometimes people ask me how much is a CO detector, my usual answer is "how much is a life"?
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Post by Bonobo on Jan 13, 2009 23:20:15 GMT 1
Franciszek, thanks! I have orderer Kidd e Nighthawk, just in case - we have a gas central/water heater in the basement. How do you order one and how much it costs? The cases of CO poisoning are as old as the hills. I have just read that every year about 20-30 people die in Krakow alone. What about whole Poland? I remember my mother how she forbade us to lock the bathroom doors while having a bath. Actually, my parents demolished the locks or hid the keys to them in all flats we lived in. They were afraid that in case of poisoning they wouldn`t be able to break through the locked door. A daughter of their acquaintances died in the bathtub in this way. I heard this story as a child. |
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Post by franciszek on Jan 14, 2009 1:23:12 GMT 1
It is a needless way to die and me and my fellow gas fitters strive to prevent the death of another human being just because they need to be warm or they need some hot water to bathe in. These appliances are basic machines designed to heat water and nothing else to take a life this is not in their manual.people have said to me that they fall asleep when the fire is on but not when it is off so i say the fire is faulty get it fixed or you could die
CARBON MONOXIDE DEATHS due to faulty gas appliances should not occur but they keep on happening there is no need all that is needed is that people need to be educated on the problems and the symptoms then we might get somewhere on solving this global issue
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Post by franciszek on Jan 14, 2009 1:38:37 GMT 1
Franciszek, thanks! I have orderer Kidd e Nighthawk, just in case - we have a gas central/water heater in the basement. How do you order one and how much it costs? The cases of CO poisoning are as old as the hills. I have just read that every year about 20-30 people die in Krakow alone. What about whole Poland? I remember my mother how she forbade us to lock the bathroom doors while having a bath. Actually, my parents demolished the locks or hid the keys to them in all flats we lived in. They were afraid that in case of poisoning they wouldn`t be able to break through the locked door. A daughter of their acquaintances died in the bathtub in this way. I heard this story as a child. where the water heaters in the bathroom in the UK this is only allowed if the appliance is room sealed this means it takes it combustion air from outside and not from the room that it is installed yours would have been an open flued appliance so it would draw air from the bathroom when you shut the bathroom door it would use all the air in the bathroom by leaving the door open it would get oxygen (for combustion} from other rooms thats why you would had been asked to leave the door open. This my educated guess and if i am wrong then i apologize. |
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Post by tufta on Jan 14, 2009 18:57:07 GMT 1
How do you order one and how much it costs? I found this shop www.sklep.e-system.com.pl/and ordered through their web-site. Today the alarm arrived. The cost was 162 PLN plus 17 PLN for the carrier, all paid on arrival. It works! Once again - thank you Franciszek. |
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Post by Bonobo on Jan 14, 2009 21:27:38 GMT 1
How do you order one and how much it costs? The cases of CO poisoning are as old as the hills. I have just read that every year about 20-30 people die in Krakow alone. What about whole Poland? I remember my mother how she forbade us to lock the bathroom doors while having a bath. Actually, my parents demolished the locks or hid the keys to them in all flats we lived in. They were afraid that in case of poisoning they wouldn`t be able to break through the locked door. A daughter of their acquaintances died in the bathtub in this way. I heard this story as a child. where the water heaters in the bathroom in the UK this is only allowed if the appliance is room sealed this means it takes it combustion air from outside and not from the room that it is installed yours would have been an open flued appliance so it would draw air from the bathroom when you shut the bathroom door it would use all the air in the bathroom by leaving the door open it would get oxygen (for combustion} from other rooms thats why you would had been asked to leave the door open. This my educated guess and if i am wrong then i apologize. The door is always closed during a bath in a Polish bathroom. There is a ventillation opening at the bottom of the door. In the bathroom wall there are two ventillation shafts - one is free/open and the other is connected to the gas heater by a flexible metal pipe. |
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Post by Bonobo on Jan 14, 2009 21:33:33 GMT 1
Good prevention is better than cure, sometimes people ask me how much is a CO detector, my usual answer is "how much is a life"? That is a good answer. I am going to get one too. Thanks, tufta, for the site. |
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Post by franciszek on Jan 14, 2009 21:35:32 GMT 1
sounds logical theoretically but i always prefer room sealed appliances myself but this is just my opinion just glad people are seeing this thread and taking the advise
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